Jesus in the Old Testament?

Ever read this passage and was confused?

Jhn 8:56 – (Jesus speaking)Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”
Jhn 8:57 – “You are not yet fifty years old,” the Jews said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”
Jhn 8:58 – “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!

Many Christians don’t consider the fact that Christ the Messiah existed before His miraculous birth with Mary. Since Christ is one with God (John 1:1, John 10:30) and God has always existed that means Jesus has also always existed long before the events of the New Testament and even before time itself! Other scriptures such as Ephesians 3:9, Colossians 1:16, and Revelation 4:11 say that Jesus created everything at the beginning of time (Genesis 1:1) or that God created it all through Jesus. This is scriptural evidence for the trinity and diety of Christ. Now it is apparent that some say Jesus was or is an angel or some other created being however, scriptures such as John 1:1, and Hebrews 1:1-6 do not allow for such ideas as angels worship Him and Christ is described as being distinctly different and higher than the angels. Also keep in mind that God the Father is not visible but Jesus is the physical manifestation of God, no one can see God and live (Exo 33:20, Jhn1:18) but many have seen Jesus and identified Him as God.

Here’s a brief overview of some of what I believe are or could be appearances of the Son of God (Christ) before His entrance to our world at the nativity scene.

1. Jesus was in the fire with Sharach, Meshach, and Abednego. 
Nebuchadnezzar said “I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire; and they are not hurt, and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.” In the OT Sons of God referred to angels and later Nebuchadnezzar also says”Blessed be the God of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego, who sent His Angel and delivered His servants who trusted in Him”. But it could be that this was Christ in a glorified form since angel means “messenger” and Christ’s unique role is that of bringing messages from time to time (ultimately for bring the message of salvation) this could have been Christ in the fire.

2. Jesus appears to Ezekiel
In Ezekiel chapter 1 the prophet has a heavenly vision of a man sitting high up on a throne of sapphire on a foundation of cyrstal, his voice has authority, his waste up is like amber with flames of fire from from it, and he had a colorful aura like a rainbow surrounding him. Chapter 1 concludes with “This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the LORD. So when I saw it, I fell on my face, and I heard a voice of One speaking.” We find in the New Testament that Jesus is the image or God, the representation or likeness of His glory (Heb 1:3, Col 1:15). And to connect the dots we find in the book of Revelation that John has a heavenly vision of Christ that is somewhat similar to Ezekiels:

Rev 1:13 – and in the midst of the seven lampstands [One] like the Son of Man, clothed with a garment down to the feet and girded about the chest with a golden band.
Rev 1:14 – His head and hair [were] white like wool, as white as snow, and His eyes like a flame of fire;
Rev 1:15 – His feet [were] like fine brass, as if refined in a furnace, and His voice as the sound of many waters;

3. Christ talked to Gideon
In Judges 6 Gideon is visited by the “Angel of the Lord” and calls Him Lord in verse 13 and 15 and in verse 14 and 16 it says the Lord replied to Gideon (not an angel). The original Hebrew word used for the speaker is  Jehovah, not an angel. Many times when Christ appeared under the Old Covenant He is called the Angel of the Lord which simply means a messenger of the Lord (Jehovah). The “Angel of God” who spoke with Gideon has a staff which He used to touch an offering that Gideon brought Him and it was consumed by fire. This is unusual behavior if it were an ordinary angel. This heavenly man also promised Gideon that He would be with him in battle as he defeated the Midianites, again an statement unlikely to be spoken by an ordinary angel.

4. Christ talked to Hagar Genesis 16:7-13
After Hagar was kicked out of Abraham’s house hold by Sarah the Angel of the Lord visits Hagar in the wilderness. This “angel” says with authority “I will multiply your descendants exceedingly, so that they shall not be counted for multitude.”
Gen 16:13 – Then she called the name of the LORD who spoke to her, You-Are-the-God-Who-Sees; for she said, “Have I also here seen Him who sees me?”
In Exodus 33:20 God says that no one can see God (The Father) and live which is also restated in John 1:18, but since Christ is the image of God we are allowed to see Jesus and live as many have. Hagar knows it is fatal to see God the Father and so asks her strange question in verse 13.

5. Appeared at the burning bush Exodus 3:2-6
The Angel of the Lord is in the fire on the unburning bush yet God speaks to Moses from the bush it is as if God speaks through the “Angel of the Lord” exclusively. Also present is a flame of fire which is a manifestation of the Holy Spirit as seen in Acts. Here we have the trinity clearly outlined in one famous scene!

Advertisements

7 thoughts on “Jesus in the Old Testament?

  1. How I read this…

    Jhn 8:56 – (Jesus speaking)Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

    My translation:

    “Your anscestor Abraham celebrated my birthday. He saw it [my birthday] and was delighted.”

    So, Jesus says that Abraham saw Miriam birth a baby boy… Jesus.

    Then, the obvious reaction:

    Jhn 8:57 – “You are not yet fifty years old,” the Jews said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”

    My translation:

    “But… but… your not even 50 years old… how can you say that you’ve seen Abraham?”

    Of course, Jesus said no such thing. He said that Abraham witnessed *his* birthday.

    Then, the punchline:

    Jhn 8:58 – “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!“

    My translation:

    “I’m telling you the facts: I was am [currently] BEFORE Abraham’s birthday!”

    In other words, “Abe hasn’t even been born yet!”

  2. I think Jesus first made an appearance in the old testament as Adam because:
    1. Both of their names are very similar.
    2. They both had women in their lives.
    3. They both had the same dad.
    4. They were both betrayed.
    5. They both died in similar mysterious circumstances.
    6. They both cried, Adam in that painting and jesus in the exclamation ‘Jesus wept!’
    7. They both gave sermons, adam to his wife after she had some fruit and jesus on his mound.

    If you research even more detail then you find jesus before even the old testament in the chapter called contents. It says in my book ‘jesus gets born page 4.

    • That’s something I honestly have never heard of before. And I appreciate you posting it here as I love to see other’s views and beliefs, as well as to challenge my own. However, with all respect towards you I don’t see your similarities or argument very convincing.
      There are my quick thoughts on your points
      1. How are they similar? Their meanings in Hebrew are quite different.
      2. Adam was (in a way) married, Jesus however was never married, he only had friendships with women.
      3. Very true!
      4. I don’t know if you could call Eve’s sin (or Satan’s deception) “betrayal”, how was Adam betrayed?
      5. We don’t know how Adam died, and Jesus’s death was not mysterious. So how can we say their deaths were similar?
      6. Is a painting portraying Adam crying equivalent to scriptural truth? I mean.. I’m sure he did cry (he was human afterall) but.. a painting is a bit of a stretch.
      7. I guess you could see his teaching to Eve as the first sermon! Pretty cool idea.

      But beyond this I see deeper problems with saying that Adam was pre-incarnate Jesus. Firstly: Adam sinned. So you’re saying that Jesus (who is God in flesh, even if it were in Adam) sinned. And secondly the scriptures do not hint at reincarnation or that Adam was Jesus. Romans 5:13 says sin reigned in Adam, hard to see this as applying to Christ, the Messiah, God in flesh.
      1Corinthians 15:21&22, 15:45 list Adam and Christ as different individuals, with different purposes and different choices made.
      1Corinthians 15:47 also separates Adam as being from dust (created) and Christ being from Heaven (uncreated)
      And lastly Romans 5:14 says that Adam was a type (foreshadowing of some attributes) of Jesus, not that he was a preincarnation or earlier reincarnation of Jesus.
      Other characters have much closer similarities to Jesus like David or Joseph, but they also are types, not literal iterations of Christ the messiah. What do you think of my comments? I don’t mean to argue but only to discuss in a mature, and informed way.

  3. It would surprise the Jewish people that our Christian Messiah is in the Old Testament, wouldn’t it? In fact, it is ONLY Yahshua (Jesus) who is in the OT. YHWH the Father has never appeared to man (JOHN 1:18, I JOHN 4:12). I used to stumble over the Trinity because of DEUT. 6:4, like the Jews do. So I eventually decided the Trinity is a deception and came up with a totally different concept about YHWH being the Father, Son, AND Holy Spirit. It says that YHWH is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth, doesn’t it? He is not three, but One. You might like to read about it in my post ‘YHWH the Son’. And about the future which differs markedly from your ideas.
    Debra

  4. Thanks for commenting, and welcome to my blog. I am interested in your view on this, I could not find your post you mentioned but please answer these questions I have.
    If the Father has not revealed Himself to man as you said (which I agree with you) but Jesus did reveal Himself to man – how are the Father and Jesus still one?
    Do you believe Jesus is God?
    Why is Elohim plural?
    Who does “Us” and “Our” in Genesis 1:26 refer to?
    I believe in the trinity but I also believe God is one, not three (that would be polytheism) but maybe we’re just running in to demantics on terms like “trinity”, “one”, and “three”. What do you think?

  5. There is widespread evidence that in the biblical world animals were slaughtered in treaty contraction ceremonies. When the parties to the treaty walked between the rows of freshly killed animal flesh, they placed a curse upon themselves — May they too be cut limb from limb if they violate the treaty or covenant. This explains a passage from Jeremiah:

    “The men who have violated my covenant and have not fulfilled the terms of the covenant they made before me, I will treat like the calf they cut in two and then walked between its pieces. The leaders of Judah and Jerusalem, the court officials, the priests and all the people of the land who walked between the pieces of the calf, I will hand over to their enemies who seek their lives. Their dead bodies will become food for the birds of the air and the beasts of the earth.” (Jeremiah 34:18-20)

    Oh that day that is described in Genesis chapter 15, Abraham fell into a deep sleep and had a vision of God making a covenant with mankind. Abraham is a mere man and not worthy enough to go through the covenant-making process with God. Genesis 15:17 talks about a smoking furnace and a burning lamp (or torch) passing through the carcasses. My pastor said that this was symbolizing God and, yep, you guessed it, JESUS, making a covenant for mankind, on behalf of Abraham.

    I’m just throwing yet another idea out there.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s